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https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl DIY Forum >> Plumbing Questions >> Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1201123622 Message started by red-robbo on Jan 23^rd, 2008, 9:27pm

Title: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by red-robbo on Jan 23^rd, 2008, 9:27pm

Hi all, newbie here looking for some advice.

I have a 12 year old oil boiler as above, and over the past couple of years I have been getting lock outs. I have had it serviced for the past couple of years, and when mentioned to the service engineer he advised that we turn it down a little to see if it stops locking - which it does for 6-9 months, then it starts locking out again - I am a dab hand at pulling the front off an pressing the reset button.

I am now down from the top seting to number 1, and I am getting lock-outs again. The service guy advised that it could be 1 of 4 things, which he could try and replace one by one, with a parts price of c. £200 and who knows how much in labour.

Should I let this guy replace these 4 bits one by one in the hope of finding a cure and allowing me to go back up to a reasonable heat setting like 4 or something, or should I consider replacing it with another one exactly the same - they appear to be between £800 and £1,000 inc VAT, but no idea how much labour time is required to do a complete swap.

Any ideas as to what these 4 items might be, and anyone with any experience in sorting out these lock-outs or am I best to just replace the darn thing.

Thanks
red-robbo. :-?

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by thescruff on Jan 23^rd, 2008, 10:42pm

Where are you for starters, have you tried another oil engineer that knows what he's doing.

What is locking out the burner or the boiler.

Does the boiler run for a while before locking out, if so how long does the rads etc get hot.

What does the engineer do when he give it a service, it takes over an hour to do properly nearer two.

Important bits are to clean the combustion head, non return valve, and the baffles.

see below.

14.1 The following should be carried out at least once per year
for 28 second Kerosene and twice per year for 35 second Gas
Oil, to ensure efficient, trouble free operation.
1. Carry out a pre-service check noting any operational faults.
2. Check and clean the burner.
3. On the CF model check and clean the air intake grille located
in the boiler room.
4. On the RS balanced flue model check and clean the air intake
ducts at the rear and underneath the boiler and the air intake
grille at the end of the terminal.
5. Check and clean the baffle retainer (20/25, 26/32, 32/50
and 50/70 models).

7. Check and clean the baffles.
8. Check and clean the heat exchanger surface.
9. Check the heat shield (20/25, 26/32, 32/50 and 50/70
models).
10. Check the combustion chamber base insulation board.
11. Check that the flue system is unobstructed and clean as
necessary.
12. If the appliance has been installed in a compartment check
that the ventilation areas are clear.
13. Clean all oil filters.
Some of the servicing points are covered more fully in the
following instructions:-
14.2 Pre-Service Check
1. Remove the cabinet front and top panels as described in
section 5 .
2. On the RS balanced flue model remove the burner box cover
as described in Section 5.5.
3. Operate the appliance and system, noting any faults which
may need to be corrected during the service.
14.3 Cleaning the Burner
IMPORTANT: Disconnect the electrical supply at the mains
before commencing any servicing. Turn off the oil at the service
cock.
1. Remove the burner.
(a) Isolate the oil supply at both the oil tank and the isolating
valve situated above the burner on the right-hand side. (See
Figs. 2 and 3).
(b) On the RS balanced flue model remove the burner box cover
by pulling forwards to release the ball studs. This will be found
easier by pulling on one side of the handle first to release two of
the ball studs and then repeating on the other side. Take care
not to pivot the remaining two ball studs too far around as this
will cause damage to the spring clips.
(c) Disconnect the electrical lead from the control box by
depressing the two locking ears on the plug and pulling
downwards.

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by thescruff on Jan 23^rd, 2008, 11:40pm

Missed a bit ::)

Electro Oil Inter B11
(a) Remove the acoustic fan inlet cover.
(b) Remove the three screws holding the fan cowl in position
and remove the cowl noting how the fan control flap is
positioned.
(c) Check that the air control flap pivots freely and ensure the air
path to the burner head is clear.
(d) Clean both sides of the fan impeller and remove any debris
from the burner housing.
(e) Check that the impeller rotates freely.
(f) Re-assemble the components.

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by red-robbo on Jan 24^th, 2008, 9:36pm

Hi,

Thanks for such a comprehensive response.

I am based in North Wiltshire, and had extreme difficulty finding someone who could look at the boiler. Firstly the guy that originally installed it was no longer qualified to work on them anymore, the second guy was an installer only and did not do repairs (but did show us the reset button given that we had been without heat and hot water for a few days mid-winter and the 3rd guy was all I could find who would service/repair - who has been out 3 times now to service.

I am not sure if it is the boiler or burner locking out, but I have to take the front panel off, and then pull the bottom metalwork off and press the reset button on the right hand side of this to get it working again.

With regards operation, it will work quite happily on a low setting for a couple of weeks, and then go through a phase of locking out every day or more for a week, and will then run for a couple of weeks again and then we start again. Central heating and water work perfectly, either alone or combined, and there appears to be no pattern as to when it will fail - so essentially totally unreliable. If I turn the temp on the boiler up, it will fail in 20 mins or so guaranteed.

Any assistance most welcome

The engineer that comes out typically spends between 40 and 60 mins doing the annual service if that helps any.

Thanks again.
red-robbo :-?

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by thescruff on Jan 24^th, 2008, 10:42pm

We need to establish what is locking out, below should be a pic of your burner with an arrow pointing at the reset button on the burner, is that what you press.

How far north of Bath are you ::)

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by thescruff on Jan 24^th, 2008, 10:43pm

Which model do you have.

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by red-robbo on Jan 24^th, 2008, 10:46pm

Hi,

That's the button I am pressing. I am about 15-20 miles from Bath nr. J17 of M4.

Cheers
red-robbo

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by red-robbo on Jan 24^th, 2008, 10:50pm

sorry missed your second post. I don't know if it is a CF or RS? - all that is on the outside is Worcester Danesmore 20/25 - it does not have a built in timer etc, that is a separate Potterton unit attached to a Honeywell FrostStat.

cheers
red-robbo

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by thescruff on Jan 24^th, 2008, 10:57pm

See pm.

The CF has a great big flue up the wall, whereas the RS is a square box through the wall. Then you have kitchen models with a white case and boiler house models which don't ;D

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by cr chimney liners on Nov 11^th, 2009, 10:15pm

I have the same oil boiler and mine is going into lockout every now and then ?

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by CWatters on Nov 13^th, 2009, 7:51pm

Try a PM to red-robbo to see if he got his fixed.

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by cr chimney liners on Nov 18^th, 2009, 7:30pm

Boiler man came today, he thinks its the EB1 transformer, new one fitted, lets wait and see.

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by Keefie on Feb 7^th, 2010, 8:43pm

Hi

I'm a newbie and have the same problem with intermittent lock out. Did changing the transformer fix the problem ?

Kind regards

Keith

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by Paul on Apr 9^th, 2010, 6:00pm

We had a similar situation happen last year, ours turned out to be the motor was on the way out, so every now and then we weren't getting enough oil pressure for a stable burn.

The engineer showed me the old motor and you could actually feel that the bearings had gone.

Paul

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by sumps on Apr 9^th, 2010, 11:19pm

Ok - I have not long bought a house with one of these fitted. I didnt keep my eye on the level subsequently the oil ran very low in the tank...hence not much hot water in the morning! The boiler unit has been serviced just before we moved in.

The pump is the one pictured above (RS - with a silver vent box on the outside wall) and I had to push the button (indicated above) to start the sequence. I can here the pump running and one or two clicks a number of seconds in, then it runs down and stops, there is no "woomph" of the oiler lighting up . I have tried this about 3 times, but dont want to do this any more as I dont want to risk needles damage.

Is this a case of the unit needs a bleed due to running out of oil or is there something more to this?

Please help - Kind regards
S

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by thescruff on Apr 10^th, 2010, 1:57am

Yes you need to bleed the air out of the line, or you'll burn the pump out.

Turn the valve off, and disconnect the flexible, stick the end in a vessel and draw some oil through by opening the valve, reconnect flexible and test.

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by sumps on Apr 10^th, 2010, 7:11pm

Thanks scruff it worked, although I had to do it 2 times, maybe I didnt draw enough oil off first time

Kind regards
S

Title: Re: Danesmoor 20/25 Lock Out's
Post by stuntcellist on Sep 7^th, 2010, 11:12pm

Hello. I'm new to this forum and I have a new question relating to this boiler. I'm not sure if this the right place to pose it -- so:
I bought one second hand about 5 years ago and serviced and installed it myself. I have replaced various bits including the oil pump and the jet.
It has been very reliable but recently it has been running intermittantly -
When the system is up to temperature, the combustion will burn for about 30 secs. quite happily, - then stop for 5 secs, then reignite etc. It seems to work fine for the initial (long) heat-up. I have a pressure guage fitted on the burner and I have the pressure set to 110 - it stays quite steady. The air setting is at about 7 - a bit high according to the books but I adjusted it to a point where there was no smoke etc. I have cleaned the optical sensor but I haven't recently done a complete service. I've tried setting the thermostat higher etc. but Im sure this isn't the problem because the blower keeps going. If the problem caused it to shut down or lock out it wouldn't be quite so mysterious -- any ideas??
Thanks.