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https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl DIY Forum >> Carpentry Questions >> Web site https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1258296908 Message started by woodsmith on Nov 15^th, 2009, 2:55pm

Title: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 15^th, 2009, 2:55pm

I've just spent most evenings last week and all this weekend setting up a new website. I have no expertise in this area but needed a website and didn't think that it was worth it for me to pay the sort of money a professional firm would charge. So I have had a go at DIY and used a site builder template provided by the host. It has been bloody frustrating at times, template was suposed to be WYSIWYG, but it was more like DTETUDA, Deletes template every time user does anything ::) ;D

I'm laughing now it is hopefully finished.

Here's a link http://www.shropshire-woodsmiths.co.uk/

Any opinions, positive or negative, gratefully recieved.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by TIMBA-WOLF on Nov 15^th, 2009, 3:34pm

Very impresive the pair of you!! very informative to.......and i notice a certain madam still got her "House" in one of the gallery images... typical!!

as for DTETUDA.. you obviously have the same software i tried!!

seriously , neat, tidy and to the point.. Bravo!!! ;)

Title: Re: Web site
Post by big_all on Nov 15^th, 2009, 5:16pm

good website keith
does judith turn to the tools often ;D ;D

and i love the charles remy mackintosh giraffee chair ;D ;D

Title: Re: Web site
Post by sparky415 on Nov 15^th, 2009, 5:38pm

Woody,
Looks good to me,
Nice and easy to contact you,
(I sometimes give up looking on some sites)

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 15^th, 2009, 6:01pm

Wolf, I know my place ;D

BA, Judith has her own tool budget :o got herself a scrollsaw, I think she spends more time in the workshop than me ;D

Sparky, thanks, now I just need a few big orders to come in

Title: Re: Web site
Post by LS on Nov 15^th, 2009, 6:11pm

Nice website, I must say it makes me quite jeleaous.. Really must get mine finished, but it's having the time!

Title: Re: Web site
Post by londonman on Nov 15^th, 2009, 10:32pm

Nice and clean. I like the colour scheme. Very readable. The one thing that I don't like is that a web page doesn't all fit on one screen and you have to scroll down to see all the pictures as they fall off the bottom of the screen.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by TIMBA-WOLF on Nov 15^th, 2009, 11:59pm

londonman wrote on Nov 15^th, 2009, 10:32pm:

just buy a bigger screen cheap skate... LOL!!!! ::) ::) ::)

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 16^th, 2009, 7:40am

londonman wrote on Nov 15^th, 2009, 10:32pm:

This has been the problem of using a fixed template, it will only let me put pictures down the right hand side of the screen. I wanted to have the pages so they didn't need scrolling but I could have only one maybe two pictures per page. It's been really frustrating doing this. I had it set so that a mouse over a picture brought up others but it worked fine initially and then next day it didn't for no reason >:(. In the end I just kept it simple and accepted the scrolling.

I've been meaning to set up a website for years, finally got my finger out and spent a week doing this, hopefully it will be worth it.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Lectrician on Nov 16^th, 2009, 8:16am

Most websites these days drop off the bottom of the page, it is generally excepted these days.

It is good to try to keep the front page on one screen if possible.

The template is geared up for people who use a low resolution too - you may notice large spaces on the left/right of the website (if you do not, you must have your PC set to a low resolution).

Looks good WS.

As for your mouse overs, where they done using CSS or javascript? You may have just dropped a link somewhere.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by CWatters on Nov 16^th, 2009, 8:26am

Web site looks very professional, well done. Got a few minor comments:

Not sure I would have put everything you have on the "About Us" page. I'm fairly sure your real reason for retiring from BT was to spend more time doing what you love.

Personally I also like to see a postal address on web sites but I can understand the advantages and dissadvantages of that. Likewise an email address as well as a form to fill (My email program keeps a copy of sent mail automatically, my browser doesn't).

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Joiner on Nov 16^th, 2009, 9:00am

Good site, Keith!

Only a couple of points…

The requirements for obtaining LBC are not peculiar to Shropshire but are now statutory throughout England.

As for obtaining work in the field of conservation, the old system of ‘known tradesmen’ lists kept by the local authority has been superceded by the Trader Register (www.traderregister.org.uk). On first contact with the CO, owners of old properties looking for a local tradesman will frequently ask them who they can recommend, which is when they’ll now be referred to the Trader Register. In my experience this happens regardless of whether you’ve got a website because it gives the tradesmen on that list the appearance of credibility, whether a reality or not!

Be aware also, Keith, that I know of no tradesman who charges for obtaining LBC or any of the other permissions for the simple reason that the customer plays one off against the other. There are other issues here, but they’re too involved to be gone into without boring everyone to death.

And explain the Charles Rennie Mackintosh connection with the Hill House-modelled furniture, especially that wonderful chair. Not everyone will get the allusion. Perhaps a link to a Mackintosh site?

Having decided to retire next year, if anything in your neck of the woods comes my way I’ll point them in your direction. Get your head around sash windows though and get your name on that Trader Register. For some reason they reckon to take eight bloody weeks from receiving your ‘agreement’ to actually putting your details on the site! Typical. A lot of guys are now putting the Trader Register logo on their sites because it makes them look "accredited", so you need to match them.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 16^th, 2009, 9:05am

Lec the big blank sections are annoying but part of the template, nothing I can do about it. You have to remember I know nothing about HTML or the like. The mouse over was set up using options from drop down boxes worked OK one day then when I turned it on next day it didn't work at all. The template we used was our fourth choice, the previous three we tried did not work at all so we were up against it from the start.

CW I think you are right and I've maybe been a bit to open on the a about us page. I'll change it today.

As for the address, its where the workshop is, but I know what you mean its the first thing I too look for on a web site :-/

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Joiner on Nov 16^th, 2009, 9:38am

Reason for NOT putting your address on a web site, especially if you live in a rural area and depend on your tools to make a living?

One guess!

The observant may have noticed that when I published that picture of my workshop there was NOTHING to identify it as what it was. We have CCTV around the barns because of thefts of tack and malicious wounding of horses and my alarm will wake the dead, but it's of no use if the stealymen choose to ignore the notices (around the barns, not the workshop) because who the hell's going to hear it in the middle of nowhere?

The reason there are no notices about the alarms in the workshop is to avoid telling the scroats that there's something worth nicking there, and the image of them crapping themselves when all hell breaks loose is one I'd treasure whilst counting the cost of their visit!!

They'll come around innocently "looking for somewhere to stable their horse", when in reality they're casing the joint. The last farm I had my workshop on had a Range Rover nicked, which they used to transport all the riding tack and chainsaws they'd lifted from one of the barns, despite all the dogs and "security" lights. The police questioned me because they wanted to know "why was nothing stolen from your workshop, sir?"

Because they didn't know I was there, because I was probably out on site when they came to check the place out!

It's amazing how respectable they look when they come around "Just to take a look at what you do." Unless they've phoned first and been invited over, NO ONE gets a warm welcome when they come calling on spec.

With a web site you don't NEED any other address than your email.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 16^th, 2009, 11:17am

Oh bloody hell I've just changed it to add the address now I've got to change it back ::) >:( ;D ;) :P

There must be a parable about this, now you mention ponies

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Joiner on Nov 16^th, 2009, 12:15pm

Sorry about that, matey, but it's a REAL problem in such a rural county.

When that Range Rover was nicked we think the gang who did it had either come to the farm to ask about putting a caravan there or had just walked through the farm on the footpath that went right through the yard!

The cheekiest theft was from friends who had a lot of plant around the place whilst they were renovating their current property, living in a caravan on ground just above the site.

An amazing coincidence was that they were waiting for a mate of theirs to come and look at their oil tank. He drove a black Mitsubishi Warrior pick up.

Sandra was in the kitchen of the caravan and saw a black Mitsubishi Warrior back into their yard. It was only when the passenger got out and started to hitch up their £3,500 trailer to the pick up that she started to wonder whether something was up. By the time she got to the door the pick-up was driving out the gate. She phoned Alan, who was down at the house and said she thought someone was nicking the trailer. He got to the road just as the pick-up careered past. Phoned the police who appeared three hours later.

No point following because they could have gone any of three ways from the end of their lane, although if Alan had thought about it he could have phoned a few mates who could have kept watch on different routes past their place. Trouble is, they were in a state of shock for about an hour afterwards trying to get their heads around how anyone could be so brazen.

(Oh, and I'm sitting here instead of working because having had the terrible trots last week, putting me in bed for two days, the stuff taken to block me up has now made me bloody constipated, so I'm now dizzy, have the sweats and thoroughly pissed off.)

Title: Re: Web site
Post by NickW on Nov 16^th, 2009, 1:23pm

Sorry Keith, but you'll have to put your address back again. There is a legal requirement for it, see for example this part of the Companies House web site. Not that many people seem to knoa about it though.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Lectrician on Nov 16^th, 2009, 3:47pm

Only if your a limited company though?

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Joiner on Nov 16^th, 2009, 5:11pm

Definitely only if you're a limited company!

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 16^th, 2009, 7:18pm

Joiner wrote on Nov 16^th, 2009, 9:00am:

Be aware also, Keith, that I know of no tradesman who charges for obtaining LBC or any of the other permissions for the simple reason that the customer plays one off against the other. There are other issues here, but they’re too involved to be gone into without boring everyone to death.

My idea is to get listed building consent for the client. I fill out all the forms, do a design statement and a set of drawings plus site maps; all in triplicate. I liaise with the CO and act as agent until we have consent. Client pays me a fee and then he can take the drawings round to get other quotes if he wants. It doesn't really matter (too much) if I get to make and fit the window as I have been paid for my time thus far.

I wouldn't mind doing this full time, saves fitting windows in the rain ;D

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 16^th, 2009, 7:24pm

Thanks for all the comments, much appreciated. I've made quite a few changes today. Address off and on and on and off, but until we go limited I'm going to keep it off. Someone could do a whois though and probably get the info anyway.

Looking at the site statistics I've already had viewings from Canada, Ukrane, Latvia, and Sweden. I wonder if they need some new windows? As long as they are not sliding sash I'm OK ;) :-X

;D

Title: Re: Web site
Post by londonman on Nov 16^th, 2009, 10:18pm

Just a slight digression but following the theft strand, on the website that shows crime by area, if you look around Worcester there is in the city a relatively high proportion of crime as you'd expect. Looking further out into the surrounding countryside it all goes very quiet until you realise that there is a very large hotspot around Pirton. One guess as to what part of our community has a large number of residential sites there. Could there be a connection? Could there just perhaps be some truth in the commonly held believe that they are all thievin' barstewards?

Title: Re: Web site
Post by scotspark on Nov 16^th, 2009, 10:35pm

looks good Keith

wanna do mine ;)

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Joiner on Nov 17^th, 2009, 6:32am

The fact that you've had hits from so far afield is one of the problems of depending on the site to obtain work. I was getting enquiries from places (unlike yours they were all within the UK) that were well outside my radius of travel, which is 40 miles. It's one of the reasons I ditched the web site, servicing those enquiries was simply impossible, let alone impracticable. I never got one hit from within that working radius in over eighteen months, so in practical terms it might just as well not have been there.

I later learnt that, unless you're intending on mail order, it's possible to limit the coverage of your site to one with a less scattered profile. Cwatters will probably know how it's done because that advice was given on another forum we both frequent. Remember that Colin? (If I can find the relevent thread I'll post a link.)

And on the issue of LBC... Everything you mention were the "other issues" referred to in my earlier post. Good luck if you can get that kind of fee, but I (and others) do it as part of the service. The other consideration is that, in the competitive situation created by an associated application for grant funding, your involvement in the tendering process will create a conflict of interest. I HAVE had to decline requests to do ALL the work of obtaining LBC for the customer for this very reason, but agreeing to do the Design & Access Statement because that’s a ten minute job and can be emailed or faxed to the customer.

That's only a word to the wise. Where grants are concerned the funding will be based on the lowest quote. It's up to the customer who they appoint to the job because if that person isn't the cheapest the customer will still only receive funding based on the lowest quote. I've done a few grant-aided jobs where I've not been the cheapest, but the customer HAS been familiar with my work.

That's largely academic now, with the loss of so many grant schemes (Shropshire was one of the most generous), but there are still English Heritage match-funding schemes in the offing, in which case there needs to be three quotes if the job is over £5,000, two if under that. What often happens is the customer will have been given those figures by the CO and advised to get the quotes first before doing anything else. From the customer’s perspective the choice of tradesman will have been made at that point. If it’s you, then when they get back to you to confirm you as their choice is when they either ask you to handle the LBC or you make the offer, either way it makes your life easier to deal direct with the CO. You’ll be producing the detailed joinery drawings at this point anyway, the rest is just filling in forms.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Joiner on Nov 17^th, 2009, 7:13am

Found that link...

http://www.ebuild.co.uk/forums/messages/11010/20240.html?1243781281

The question of marketing area isn't that far down the postings.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Bayden_Rank on Nov 17^th, 2009, 3:54pm

woodsmith wrote on Nov 16^th, 2009, 7:24pm:

Re: WHOIS - Can you not suppress the address? I know you can if not using it for trade. It might also be possible to change the registered address to an accommodation address.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 17^th, 2009, 4:39pm

wrote on Nov 17^th, 2009, 3:54pm:

[Re: WHOIS - Can you not suppress the address? I know you can if not using it for trade. It might also be possible to change the registered address to an accommodation address.

The host offers it as an extra, I think it was about £10, but I was hoping the scrotes of this world wouldn't know how to look it up. Some UK hosts offer it for free.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by CWatters on Nov 17^th, 2009, 5:40pm

Net step is a google ranking.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Bayden_Rank on Nov 17^th, 2009, 6:50pm

WS - Can you not contact Nominet to see if it can be hidden?

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 18^th, 2009, 8:53am

wrote on Nov 17^th, 2009, 6:50pm:

WS - Can you not contact Nominet to see if it can be hidden?

Thanks I'll have a look and see, although we are thinking of going limited so then we will have to put the address on anyway.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Lectrician on Nov 18^th, 2009, 6:43pm

With a limited company, many people have the 'registered office' as their accountant, and then have a seperate trading address.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by LS on Nov 18^th, 2009, 10:29pm

Yeah I've noticed that A LOT.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by Lectrician on Nov 19^th, 2009, 6:43am

It probably makes it fairly tricky to swap accountants - I think it is quite difficult to change the registered address of a company?

Title: Re: Web site
Post by greg on Nov 27^th, 2009, 7:36pm

Nice website Keith, a good way to showcase your expertise and work .

One small pedantic thing ;) on the joinery page, the understair cupboard picture needs a pronoun ,"that" or "which" in the description. Sorry but I tend to notice these things which makes me a sad git I know ;D

As a side point, in the external joinery, the garden shed, what is "triple layer wall construction"?

Thanks

Title: Re: Web site
Post by woodsmith on Nov 27^th, 2009, 8:18pm

Thanks Greg, well spotted with the typo.

Quote:

what is "triple layer wall construction"?

Its 3 layers between inside and outside ;) external skin of cladding, void behind with a breathable membrane then OSB fixed to the 4x2 studding. Keeps the place dry, draughtproof, and allows it to breathe.

Title: Re: Web site
Post by greg on Nov 28^th, 2009, 7:42am

Thanks Keith