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https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl DIY Forum >> Electrical Questions >> fire hoods for down lighters https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1099923360 Message started by mark on Nov 8^th, 2004, 2:16pm

Title: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by mark on Nov 8^th, 2004, 2:16pm

could any body clear the up the confusion as to wether fire hoods need to be fitted other down lighters in a domestic bathroom

i know if the ceiling is classed as a fire barrier than they need to be fitted

is a domestic bathroom with a plaster board ceiling classed as a fire barrier or not

if not then i take it they do not need to be fitted ?

thanks for any help

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by The_Trician on Nov 8^th, 2004, 2:29pm

Building Regs apply here, Fire containment, Sound-proofing etc.
I posted a massive amount of info on this on the Screwfix forum a few months ago.

As a general rule of thumb, then fit em, regardless as to where they are.
It is definitely a requirement if there is a habitable room above the one where you intend to fit downlighters.

TT

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by mark on Nov 8^th, 2004, 3:00pm

thanks for the above

there is only a loft above the bathroom

like you say i think it is still a bit of a grey area if and where they should be fitted

but they dont come cheap around �6.00 each x 6 lights

it soon boost the cost of the installation up

but like you say if in dout fit them

thanks for the advice

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by JerryD on Nov 8^th, 2004, 3:47pm

Funnily enough I was speaking to a Building Inspector today about this very thing. He wasn't sure so he looked it up and discovered that the firehoods are only needed where the ceiling has to be fire-protected.

For instance, in a garage with bedroom above, the ceiling must be half hour fire protected so if inset lights are used here then you MUST fit firehoods.

However, for all other situations (in a domestic setting) the firehoods are not mandatory.

I gave examples of a kitchen with bedrooms above or a bathroom with a loft above and in both circumstances he said firehoods were not needed.

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by HandyJon on Nov 8^th, 2004, 4:12pm

I gave examples of a kitchen with bedrooms above or a bathroom with a loft above and in both circumstances he said firehoods were not needed.

Which is similar to the situation where a normal light fitting is installed since there is still a comparable sized hole in the ceiling for the wires and they don't seem to require one.

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by Lectrician on Nov 8^th, 2004, 4:59pm

Grey area, different building controls require different fire ratings (time wise).

A good rule is the 'habitable room' above.

I thought houses were 30mins, and garages 1hr - ie two layers of board, and joints overlapped??

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by tellondon on Nov 8^th, 2004, 5:37pm

Isnt there national rules regarding building regulations which these fire regulations come under?

Rather than regional rules as you suggest Lectrician?

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by rabbit_rabbit on Nov 8^th, 2004, 6:03pm

I think old TT has it right - if in doubt fit em.

RR

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by HandyMac on Nov 8^th, 2004, 6:14pm

I appreciate the regs require fire hoods, and for something like a halogen downlighter the design temperature of the luminaire can be very significant. But it seems a bit of overkill to apply fire hoods to low wattage luminaires.

These fire hoods must be made of something really special given that they can cost more than the light fittings they are covering!

I've just fitted a couple of shallow recessed downlights in our kitchen. The wattage of the bulbs comes to 14w (that's 2x7w mini flourescent tubes), so the amount of heat involved is negligible. Doesn't even get warm to the touch.

These downlights wouldn't lend themselves to the witches hat type of hood because of their physical layout:

http://www.jcc-lighting.co.uk/functions/image/resize.asp?path=c:\JCC\Products\Main\381_main1.jpg&width=250

Andrew

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by rabbit_rabbit on Nov 8^th, 2004, 6:21pm

Good question (halogen GU10's 50w can get up 200 degrees C).

BUT to the best of my belief it has nothing to do with down lighters as such but a lot to do with cutting holes in plasterboard and thereby breaking the fire seal.

I better end there coz I have my own opions about this subject and best not to voice them on this public section.

Ray

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by tellondon on Nov 8^th, 2004, 7:21pm

Your right there though Ray, its because you are cutting a hole in the fire barrier, its nothing to do with the fitting or the heat it gives off

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by mark on Nov 8^th, 2004, 7:35pm

so would a plaster board ceiling above a bathroom with only a loft above be classed as a fire barrier or not

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by supersparky on Nov 8^th, 2004, 7:38pm

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by rabbit_rabbit on Nov 8^th, 2004, 7:40pm

as SS says - no unless ya sleep in the loft!

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by The_Trician on Nov 8^th, 2004, 8:16pm

Mark - where do you get the '�6 each' price from mate?

That's cheap - I've only ever found one supplier and they charge around a tenner +VAT each.
�6 sounds much more reasonable.

Any links to the site?

TT

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by Lectrician on Nov 8^th, 2004, 8:19pm

My post moved to trade only...

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by mark on Nov 8^th, 2004, 9:53pm

the site for fire covers is

www.bdc.co.uk

you will have to register and obtain a pass word before it will allow you to see the prices

if you type in cat no ENVDLC0 (last digit zero)
into search you will find them at 4 + @ �5.99 �each

1 @ ��6.49

Title: Re: fire hoods for down lighters
Post by mark on Nov 8^th, 2004, 10:03pm

IVE COPIED THE DESCRIPTION FROM THE PAGE BELOW

150 X 120MM DIAMETER X HEIGHT FIRE HOOD
Made from flexible, intumescent coated glass cloth Cable entry points for ease of use Ventilated to prevent overheating of the electrical fitting For use in fire rated and suspended ceilings in order to contain fire and maintain the ceilings fire rating Downlighter conversion Dims: (DxH) 150x120mm.

1+ � 6.49
4+ � 5.99

Special Offer Prices:
1+ � 6.49
4+ � 5.99

* ALL PRICES QUOTED ARE EXCLUDING VAT
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