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DIY Forum >> Painting, Decorating & Tiling Questions >> Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1271332709 Message started by godf on Apr 15th, 2010, 12:58pm |
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Title: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by godf on Apr 15th, 2010, 12:58pm Some of the wood around our windows is very damp, and a bit rotten (although nothing's black). We've been advised that it would probably be best to just patch it up (let the wood dry, treat it, fill it) rather than replace the wood, but we're not sure if this is the best plan in the long term. Apparently replacing it could mean we end up needing to replace almost the whole window. Any advice from here would be gratefully appreciated. Put things off and replace it all when it's really needed, or replace what's gone soft now? |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by big_all on Apr 15th, 2010, 2:04pm remove all rotten wood cutting the ends to an angle selecting a bit off timber 2mm bigger treat with stabalising solution countersink glue and screw in the peice off splice remove the last 2mm till flush fill in holes with water resistant filler if there is insuficient timber to affix the new to you will have to buy or reproduce the moulded shap reform any part components or replace complete components |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by Joiner on Apr 15th, 2010, 3:12pm What type of windows are they and how old? Is your building Listed or in a conservation area? |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by godf on Apr 15th, 2010, 4:28pm @ Joiner - it is in some sort of conservation area, but other houses have PVC windows, so it cannot be that strict. They're sash windows with a double-glazed pane - I have no idea how old as we only moved in about a year ago. @big_all - thanks for the advice. |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by londonman on Apr 15th, 2010, 9:11pm wrote on Apr 15th, 2010, 12:58pm:
If it's that bad then, yes, you would be better off replacing it. |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by Joiner on Apr 16th, 2010, 7:42am Had the damage not been as extensive as you suggest I'd have agreed with Al, but from the sound of it I'm inclined to go with Londonman and opt for replacement. The choice then is whether you do the right thing for the building and your pocket, or go with your neighbours and fit upvc. When conservation areas were established residents were given notice. That's when there was a rush to fit plastic before the conservation area order came into being, often those bloody awful top-hungs with the opener-over-fixed, followed by those even worse fixed-over-opener (to comply with fire escape regs) monstrosities, which the upvc boys sold as "looking like a sash window". You're right, conservation area status actually doesn't give much protection to the whole building because a conservation area is concerned with maintaining the character of THE AREA, so it's what can be seen from a public highway that matters. You are obliged to inform planning of your intentions, asking them for an opinion on upvc or timber, and if planning doesn't pass your application on to the conservation officer for consultation then that's their problem. Depending on their response - if the conservation officer is involved they'll stipulate like-for-like replacement - you could go ahead and fit upvc, although in that case I would strongly reccomment that you fit upvc vertical sliding sashes, which actually look very good and have a far superior action to those crap top hungs and will maintain the character of the building. In fact, if you specifiy the upvc sliding sashes at the outset you may find they'll go through without objection. As to the part of the house that can't be seen from a highway (which is defined as anything along which people can pass) - fit anything you like. Although recently retired, I've been asked to do some drawings and specs for a house neighbouring the last job I did, in a conservation area. Eight windows, but the guy has had five upvc things fitted to the rear and side of the cottage, but has to fit wooden one to the front. He's replacing 70s single-glazed casement windows with wooden double-glazed sliding sashes. As for your pocket? There is ample evidence to show that prospective buyers are attracted to properties that retain original features. I've had a number of jobs that involved the removal of upvc and aluminium windows and their replacement with wooden vertical sliding sashes. for which some councils used to give generous grants, for one job of £11,500 a grant of 60%! If you want proof of how damaging insensitive fitting of totally unsuitable upvc windows can be to a neighbourhood, take a look up your street. |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by godf on Apr 16th, 2010, 2:26pm Thanks for all the words of wisdom. We've just received a quote for the work that they think is needed: "To replace timbers in upstairs window including bottom rail of sash is £425" If we were going to go the PVC route, we'd really have to do the window beneath too (or it would look very odd). Better sound insulation would be great, but that would really get the price up (and we'd have to feel a bit guilty about the way it looks). We're currently leaning towards having them replace the timber (I wouldn't feel confident doing it myself up a ladder tbh) - although we're also worried that we've not been able to identify why they were so wet in the first place. Apparently the area above the bay looks fine. Maybe the rest of the windows will need work soon anyway. Thanks for the advice, I know it must be hard when you're not able to inspect things for yourself. |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by londonman on Apr 17th, 2010, 10:30am wrote on Apr 16th, 2010, 2:26pm:
It's usually either the putty joint failing letting water down behind it and the glass ...over many many years....and/or poor decoration underneath allowing water to wick up any endgrain. |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by Joiner on Apr 17th, 2010, 6:18pm I hope he's fully draught-proofing them for that price? |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by godf on Apr 20th, 2010, 2:32am londonman wrote on Apr 17th, 2010, 10:30am:
Thanks. I'll have a look for anything like that. I guess it would be hard to be sure though. @joiner: We're not mentioned draft proofing. Isn't that a really small job anyway? Ta. |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by Joiner on Apr 20th, 2010, 8:05pm If the draughtproofing is done properly it isn't cheap. To do the complete window, with nothing else needing doing, then it can cost around £120 per window, and that will include half a day's labour. The staff bead will be replaced, together with the parting bead, both of which will incorporate brush-strip. Then depending on how good a job you want, the bottom rail will be machined to take standard weatherstrip and the meeting rails machined to take either brush-strip or standard weatherstrip to prevent draughts. The fitting of new sash window furniture would also be standard practice unless the old fittings were good enough (or interesting enough historically) to retain. Take a look at... http://www.mightonproducts.com/catalog/sash_window_television.php?osCsid=c84ee91a0419215bb6f791bd06596112 ...and you'll see what's involved. |
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Title: Re: Damp wood arround sash windows - replace or patch? Post by godf on Apr 24th, 2010, 6:39pm Joiner wrote on Apr 20th, 2010, 8:05pm:
Thanks for that. I'm looking through. |
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