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https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl DIY Forum >> Plumbing Questions >> Best make of combi boiler https://www.askthetrades.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1338712134 Message started by woodsmith on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 9:28am

Title: Best make of combi boiler
Post by woodsmith on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 9:28am

A friend is just about to have his (gas) boiler changed, he has been recommended to fit a Worcester Bosch. Is that the best make of gas combi boiler or should he look to a different make?

Thanks

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by The_Trician on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 11:18am

This is a good question.
What's the answer? No idea!

Is the boiler being changed because the old one is faulty?
Or is it being changed in order to gain greater energy efficiency?

I've been looking at doing the same myself. but it seems that the supposed 15% better efficiency comes at an uneconomical price.

It seems that it takes longer than the brand new super-duper £2K condensing combi boiler's projected lifespan to recoup the initial outlay in terms of future savings made via reduced energy bills.

Ergo - Unless the boiler lasts longer than predicted, you'll never recoup your money.

That said, Viessmann boilers (http://www.viessmann.co.uk/en/products/gas_fired_condensing.html) seem to have a good reputation, whereas Worcester Bosch boilers are pretty crap in terms of reliability!

Valliant boilers also seem to get the thumbs-up -

http://www.vaillant.co.uk/

I'd be very interested to read further comments.

TT

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by woodsmith on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 11:24am

The old boiler is geriatric and in the cellar, they plan to have a balanced flue boiler fitted on the ground floor.

One thing they have been told is that it will take a long time for the hot water to come through so I assume that some combi boilers don't have a heat store :-/

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by The_Trician on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 11:29am

Some condensing-combis do have a small integral pre-heated reservoir, but it's best to keep the pipe runs as short as possible to minimise inconvenience in terms of burning gas whilst the water runs and runs and runs!

Best practise seems to be to install the boiler as near to the centre of the property, or as near to kitchen & bathroom as possible.

TT

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by CWatters on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 11:43am

Some Combi boilers do have a very small pre-heat store which is said to reduce the time taken to delive hot water but it can't do anything about long pipe runs.

It's worth thinking carefully before opting to change from a stored hot water system to a combi boiler... A lot depends on the size of house, the number of bathrooms, number of people and to some extent their lifestyle.

For a single person or couple living in a flat a combi boiler (essentially an instant water heater) could be the best option.

In a big house with lots of bathrooms and people a stored hot water system might be better. For example it might provide a higher flow rate than a combi boiler could allowing multiple showers to be used at once.

In between the two the choice is less clear cut.

It not necessary to change to a combi boiler to get mains pressure hot water. You can also do that with a Megaflo stored hot water system and a conventional boiler.

Before changing to any mains pressure system (combi or megaflo) the pressure and flow rate available from the mains should be checked.

If there will be long pipe runs from boiler to taps then it might be possible to eliminate the delay in hot water coming through by installing a secondary loop as they do in hotels (pipes must be well lagged though).

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by Lectrician on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 2:02pm

CWatters wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 11:43am:

If there will be long pipe runs from boiler to taps then it might be possible to eliminate the delay in hot water coming through by installing a secondary loop as they do in hotels (pipes must be well lagged though).

Obviously not on a combi though!

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by CWatters on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 7:18pm

Apparently you can have a secondary loop with some combi boilers. I believe it has to be one that can take preheated water without generating an error. Uses a pipe stat and loop pump to trigger the boiler flow sensor? Never done it, just remembering something I read a while back.

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by thescruff on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 10:03pm

Best boilers at the moment are Atmos and Intergas.

Best to get an approved installer o0r ask and we may know one in your area

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by woodsmith on Jun 4^th, 2012, 8:59am

thescruff wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2012, 10:03pm:

Best boilers at the moment are Atmos and Intergas.

Best to get an approved installer o0r ask and we may know one in your area

Thanks, he lives in Ironbridge, which is near Bridgenorth Shropshire. If you know of anyone in that area I would pass on their details.

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by The_Trician on Jun 4^th, 2012, 11:06am

Reading through this might suggest that the Atmos Design Team hasn't quite got it sorted yet.

http://www.diynot.com/forums/plumbing/atmos-boiler-flow-temp-problems.309750/

The Intergas ones look good - no needlessly complex internals to go wrong.

Mind you, they aren't cheap!

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by thescruff on Jun 4^th, 2012, 12:10pm

The Atmos is probably the slightly better but they are both made in the same stable.

I'll see who I know in the area and post it.

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by The_Trician on Jul 13^th, 2015, 5:02pm

Dragging this one back to the top -

Has ATMOS gone bang?

Been reading this -

http://www.diynot.com/diy/threads/intergas-boilers.311920/

Now that it's 2015, does anyone have any evidence that Intergas boilers are still worth considering? Or has the initial fanfare turned into a big fat raspberry?

Am thinking reliability here.

Title: Re: Best make of combi boiler
Post by thescruff on Jul 13^th, 2015, 6:12pm

The_Trician wrote on Jul 13^th, 2015, 5:02pm:

Cant remember when I installed my daughters or my intergas must be 5 years come january.

Anyways both have performe faultlessly, would I fit one again, too damn right I would.

Biggest problem is everyone keeps reminding me about the 1000s of engineers running around for WB and the handfull that Intergas have.

Maybe because Intergas really are reliable.

January 2011, it was. [smiley=thumbsup.gif]